Object Writing, Prose & Poetry Forum

ObjectWriting => Object Writing Word Of The Day => Topic started by: marksy on May 15, 2019, 10:54:43 AM



Title: QUESTION on rhymes...
Post by: marksy on May 15, 2019, 10:54:43 AM
Hey guys, sorry for posting here but no ones seems to be active on the General Forum...

My question pertains to rhymes vs identities. Pat defines an identity as syllables that start the same way. For example; fuse/confuse, lease/police, peace/piece.
 
I'm currently having a brain fart. Are words like sorrow/borrow, follow/hollow IDENTITIES or RHYMES? It appears the last vowels "o" are starting the same way with either R or L...

Another example of Identity would be unleash/McLeash.

Is it a case of the main syllable stress of the word (Masculine VS Feminine rhymes)? The main syllable stress is on the first syllable of these words - sorrow/borrow, follow/hollow. Does that mean therefore, they are (Feminine) rhymes and not identities?

Looking forward to your responses!

Currently working through one of his books


Title: Re: QUESTION on rhymes...
Post by: ChrisSoncrant on May 17, 2019, 01:23:17 AM
My take is that Identities seem to have the recognizable word in the word chosen to rhyme with it. Fuse/confuse - "fuse" is a recognizable word. Same goes for the other examples you used. In the case of peace/piece, they are only really recognizable as different words when written, as well as based on the context of the line they are found within. The problem in my mind with peace/piece is that they sound exactly the same. This is a problem (in my mind) because rhyming in songs is 100% aural and there's an expectation with rhymes that a different word be used, a word that sounds almost the same, but not 100% the same. I believe this is also why the other examples aren't rhymes, but identities. Sure "confuse" has an extra syllable in front of "fuse" and technically is a different word, but ultimately the part that is being used for rhyming is the same exact sound, which in this case is also a recognizable word.

In the case of sorrow/borrow and follow/hollow, the portion being rhymed is the "orrow"/"ollow" and that is not a recognizable word, which means our mind simply must go to what precedes it to make the rhyming sound make sense and in these examples the sounds preceding the rhyming sound (s and b/f and h) are different, thus different word, thus rhymes and not identities.

So in the case of "unleash/McLeash" - that be an identity yo.

As for the feminine and masculine I am not sure if it matters so much. I could be wrong here though. Shoot I could be wrong about all I said, but it seems to make sense to me.

Thanks for asking the question. I hope this answer has helped you as much as it has seemed to help me in writing it.

Cheers!


Title: Re: QUESTION on rhymes...
Post by: marksy on June 03, 2019, 11:59:38 PM
Hey Chris - again... so sorry for the belated reply! I totally lost track of all my posts responses.

You made totally accurate points about the sections of the words, and if individually, the sections are words unto themselves.

So, after re reading a few things... sorrow/borrow and follow/hollow are feminine rhymes. That means the main stress of the words is on the second last syllable. The second last stress (the main stress) in a feminine rhyme is where it must rhyme. It is totally acceptable to have identities follow the main stress of the words, e.g. our examples above. I believe it's acceptable for feminine rhymes to have differing endings as well.

So - you are right! Thanks very much again for your detailed responses :)

Sam